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  • Attention Salty Soldiers

    Intro
    There have been unprecedented levels of Soldier-salt since 5th ring. Some of it is justified, and some of it is not. It's time to look at things in depth, because I'm tired of seeing the same threads over and over. \(=A=\)

    Some History
    Anyway, yes. Most Soldiers got shafted when they built their character according to 4th ring abilities and the passives from rings 1-4. Soldiers have a right to complain about being misled into gear cost reallocation. If you remember, Dual Sword and Divine Smash used to scale more heavily off DEF than ATK before they changed it to a 50/50 split. Since Dual Sword's burst really blew away any other Soldier attack skills from before it came out (and there were no Dual-Sword proc weapons), Soldiers were very strongly encouraged to run tons of head/body gear for full DEF and ignore weapons. Then suddenly more ATK-based moves and Sword passives come out. Suddenly your build looks wrong. That is a legit grievance and you can be salty about it. No one will blame you for that.

    But Now
    However! People need to chill on calling the current state of Soldier so terrible. Apparently I need to break this down because these complaints aren't going away. If you build for the new sword passives, Soldier Burst/DPS is roughly equivalent to Mage and Lancer. (Nothing is comparable to Archer, so we're going to ignore that for now.)
    There are two considerations when looking at a class's damage potential: The abilities themselves and the potential stat totals of the classes.

    Comparison of Abilities
    If you compare the abilities of 5th ring Soldier to 5th ring Mage and Lancer, they are actually comparable. With small differences. Look at the abilities themselves for a second and ignore the stats behind the classes for now. I will get to the stats later. Assume you have a 100k "offense potential" that will be used in the damage calculation.
    Key
    O = Offense = 100k (as an example)
    Pow = Ability Power
    CD = Cooldown
    B = Burst (damage per use) (O * 0.4 * Pow/100)
    CE = Cost Efficiency (damage per cost) (Burst / Cost)
    DPS = well... it's DPS (damage per second) (Burst / Cooldown)








    Mage: Undermine Pow=180 CD=6 COST=12
    B=72
    CE=6
    DPS=12
    Soldier: Antagonize Pow=180 CD=6 COST=12
    B=72
    CE=6
    DPS=12
    Lancer: Severe Sting Pow=170/220 CD=7 COST=12
    B=68/88
    CE=5.66/7.33
    DPS=9.71/12.57
    Analysis:
    Undermine is the same as Antagonize, except it's 10% healing vs Taunt/ailment resist.
    Severe Sting is a little worse than the other two unless the target is in Break, but once they are it's better than both. It causes Break, too. Seems fair.

    BONUS: Soldier: Divine Smash Pow=150 CD=7 COST=12
    B=60
    CE=5
    DPS=8.57
    Analysis:
    Divine Smash is weaker than 5th ring skills, but you get Blind sometimes and aggro. Not amazing, but not horrible.
    Mage: Calamity Pow=140/220 CD=7 COST=11
    B=56/88
    CE=5.09/8
    DPS=8/12.57
    Soldier: Rage Slash Pow=160 CD=7 COST=12
    B=64
    CE=5.33
    DPS=9.14
    Lancer: Death Pierce Pow=150/200 CD=11 COST=14 (secret +50 AP while in Break, thanks @LaconicLeaf)
    B=60/80
    CE=4.29/5.71
    DPS=5.45/7.27
    Analysis:
    Calamity has the best of everything, but only if you combo it. And it has no additional effects.
    Death Pierce is only better than Rage Slash if the target is in Break, and even then it has lower DPS than Rage Slash. Death Pierce is capable of doing normal damage to super high-def targets, while Rage Slash is unaffected by defensive procs and reflect stacks. All of them have niche uses or conditions that make them outshine each other in different ways. Seems fair. (Btw for the Rage Slash haters, consider that Mages don't have a single way to cut through damage down and reflect at the moment. :c)
    Mage: Blood Oath Pow=110/165 CD=10 COST=15
    B=88/132
    CE=5.87/8.8
    DPS=8.8/13.2
    Soldier: Dual Impact Pow=130/140 CD=9 COST=15
    B=104/112
    CE=6.93/7.47
    DPS=11.56/12.44
    Lancer: Cross Assault Pow=130/140/180/190 CD=10 COST=16
    B=104/112/144/152
    CE=6.5/7/9/9.5
    DPS=10.4/11.2/14.4/15.2
    Analysis:
    Dual Impact outperforms Blood Oath unless the mage is missing some health and it outperforms Cross Assault unless the target is in Break. Standalone Blood Oath is the worst skill, but gets some healing as an additional effect. Cross Assault is nasty once the target is in Break, but that's kind of a Lancer's identity. Seems fair.

    BONUS: Soldier: Dual Sword Pow=120 CD=10 COST=18
    B=96
    CE=5.33
    DPS=9.6
    Analysis:
    A bit outclassed by 5th ring skills. The only thing it has going for it is aggro, and that it still beats full-health Blood Oath in both Burst and DPS.
    Special Bonus:
    Soldier: Counter Strike Pow=250 CD=12 COST=5
    B=100
    CE=20
    DPS=8.33
    Analysis:
    I think I can let that Cost-efficiency value speak for itself. (Wow that was a nerdy thing to say..) And it protects your allies in niche situations in GvG? Oh my. Also, check out that ability power. It's softly whispering something. Can you hear it? I think it's saying "Please crit with me..."
    Can this still proc Cost Recovery up to 4 times? My guild's soldiers have been busy/lazy and haven't tested it for me after I asked them, lol. x)

    Comparison of Potential Stat Totals
    But the abilities don't matter if classes can't have the same offense potential, right? Well, thanks to new 5th ring passives, they can. Here's a summary of relevant class passives for Mage, Soldier, and Lancer.

    Lancer
    Spears: +48%
    Other Atk Gear: +20%
    Atk +3000
    Helm Def: +32%
    Armor Def: +32%
    Other Gear Def: +17%
    Def +3000

    Mage
    Staves: +48%
    Other Matk Gear: +20%
    Matk +3000
    Hat mdef: +20%
    Clothing Mdef: +24%
    Other Gear Mdef: +17%
    Mdef +3000

    Soldier
    Swords: +48%
    Other Atk Gear: +20%
    Atk +3000
    Helms: +32%
    Armors: +44%
    Other Def Gear: +17%
    Def +3000

    See that Swords and Lances both have +48% ATK for their respective classes?
    Are you worried about Swords having less ATK than Lances just by raw stats?
    Well, let's look at the UL wiki.
    28-Cost Solar Sword at Max Infuse with +99 = 6374 ATK
    28-Cost Solar Lance at Max Infuse with +99 = 6697 ATK
    Adding passives...
    Sword = 9433.52
    Lance = 9911.56
    That's a difference of 478.04 per weapon.
    So with 7 weapons you're looking at Soldiers having about 3-4k less ATK than Lancers.
    Is that significant? In my opinion, when you're at 100k ATK or above... No. It is not signficant.
    (continued due to length)
    IGN: Mirabelle | Guild: Too Nice
    UL ID: 2104891172

  • #2
    COST ALLOCATION
    If you want to be able to get the most out of the new attacks AND the old ones, run 7/x/7/x. You can get more power out of Vanquish/CounterStrike/DualImpact/RageSlash if you put more cost into monsters, or more power out of DivineSmash/DualSword/Antagonize if you put more cost into helmets. Monsters give you flexibility and utility, while helmets give you more survivability.

    Either way, you're going to be okay. A nice option when you're using ATK-only abilities is that you can use low-DEF anti-magic gear (usually hats/clothing) without affecting your offensive ability. A Soldier with 7-9 Magic Reflect procs is going to be tricky for a Mage or Archer to take down.

    Full Example
    Gosh, you're still skeptical? Fine. Let's mock up some characters and compare, alright?

    Level 120 = 608 Cost
    Level 130 = 640 Cost
    Endgame Soldier
    The Gear:
    Twilight Blade (29 Cost, max+99 at 7109) | 7109 * 1.48 = 10521.32 ATK
    Grimm Wolf Coat: (29 Cost, max+99 at 7960) | 7960 * 1.44 = 11462.4 DEF
    Grimm Wolf Helm: (29 Cost, max+99 at 7960) | 7960 * 1.32 = 10507.2 DEF
    Vol & Rena (34 Cost, max+99 at 4310)
    4310 * 1.2 = 5172 ATK
    4310 * 1.17 = 5042.7 DEF
    Fire Valk (25 Cost, max+99 at 3410)
    3410 * 1.2 = 4092 ATK
    3410 * 1.17 = 3989.7 DEF
    Apollo (30 Cost, max+99 at 3910)
    3910 * 1.2 = 4692 ATK
    3910 * 1.17 = 4574.7 DEF
    7/6/7/2 Soldier
    Weapon Cost: 203 (7x Twilight Blade)
    Helm Cost: 174 (6x Grimm Wolf Helm) (can't fit a 7th 29-cost helmet)
    Armor Cost: 203 (7x Grimm Wolf Armor)
    Monster Cost: 59 (Vol&Rena + Fire Valk)
    Total Cost: 639/640
    ATK from Swords after passives: 73649.24
    ATK from Executioner Shared Trait: 3000
    ATK from Monsters: 9264
    Total ATK: 85913.24
    DEF from Armor after passives: 80236.8
    DEF from Helms after passives: 63043.2
    DEF from Royal Protector Shared Trait: 3000
    DEF from Monsters: 9032.4
    Total DEF: 155312.4
    ATK Ability Offensive Power: 85913.24
    ATK+DEF Ability Offensive Power (Avg of Atk&Def): 120612.82

    7/2/7/6 Soldier
    Weapon Cost: 203 (7x Twilight Blade)
    Helm Cost: 58/59 (2x Grimm Wolf Helm)
    Armor Cost: 203 (7x Grimm Wolf Armor)
    Monster Cost: 175 (Fire Valk + Apollox5)
    ATK from Swords after passives: 73649.24
    ATK from Executioner Shared Trait: 3000
    ATK from Monsters: 27552
    Total ATK : 104201.24
    DEF from Armor after passives: 80236.8
    DEF from Helms after passives: 21014.4
    DEF from Royal Protector Shared Trait: 3000
    DEF from Monsters: 24523.2
    Total DEF: 128774.4
    ATK Ability Offensive Power: 104201.24
    ATK+DEF Ability Offensive Power (Avg of Atk&Def): 116487.82

    7/2/5/7 Soldier
    Weapon Cost: 203 (7x Twilight Blade)
    Helm Cost: 58/59 (2x Grimm Wolf Helm)
    Armor Cost: 145/149 (5x Grimm Wolf Armor)
    Monster Cost: 229 (Fire Valk + 6x VolRena)
    Total Cost: 640/640 (with 5 leftover for filler gear)
    ATK from Swords after passives: 73649.24
    ATK from Executioner Shared Trait: 3000
    ATK from Monsters: 35124
    Total ATK: 111773.24
    DEF from Armor after passives: 57312
    DEF from Helms after passives: 21014.4
    DEF from Royal Protector Shared Trait: 3000
    DEF from Monsters: 34245.9
    Total DEF: 115572.3
    ATK Ability Offensive Power: 111773.24
    ATK+DEF Ability Offensive Power (Avg of Atk&Def): 113672.77
    Endgame Lancer
    The Gear:
    Twilight Spear (29 Cost, max+99 at 7471) | 7471 * 1.48 = 11057.08 ATK
    Vol & Rena (34 Cost, max+99 at 4310)
    4310 * 1.2 = 5172 ATK
    4310 * 1.17 = 5042.7 DEF
    Fire Valk (25 Cost, max+99 at 3410)
    3410 * 1.2 = 4092 ATK
    3410 * 1.17 = 3989.7 DEF
    Apollo (30 Cost, max+99 at 3910)
    3910 * 1.2 = 4692 ATK
    3910 * 1.17 = 4574.7 DEF
    7/4/4/7 Lancer
    Weapon Cost: 203 (7x Twilight Spear)
    Helm Cost: doesn't matter
    Armor Cost: doesn't matter
    Monster Cost: 229 (Fire Valk + 6x VolRena)
    Total Cost: doesn't matter
    Atk from Lances after passives: 77399.56
    Atk from Executioner Shared Trait: 3000
    Atk from Monsters: 35124
    Total ATK: 115523.56
    ATK Ability Offensive Power: 115523.56
    Mock Character Builds Summary & Analysis
    Lancer build for reference: (Should be equivalent for Mage)
    7/x/x/7 - "Glass" Lancer
    ATK Abil Offense: 115.5k

    There are 3 Soldier builds I looked at:
    7/6/7/2 - "Tank" Soldier
    ATK Abil Offense: 85.9k
    ATK+DEF Abil Offense: 120.6k
    Analysis: Noticeably worse with ATK abilities than the other builds, but base offense with ATK+DEF abilities is slightly stronger than Lancer/Mage base offense. Except for Antagonize, the ATK+DEF abilities are a little worse though, so that balances out. Low monster utility. Hardest to kill with 13 Defensive Skills. Less monsters means this build is more gem-expensive to max out due to infusions. Cannot wear clothing and still retain offensive potential. If switching class, cost setup is not so great for a Crystal Breaker but should be fine for a Cleric.

    7/2/7/6 - "Hybrid" Soldier
    ATK Abil Offense: 104.2k
    ATK+DEF Abil Offense: 116.4k
    Already much stronger with ATK abilities. Only slightly weaker than 7/6/7/2 when using ATK+DEF abilities if using all Fire monsters. Slightly better than 7/2/5/7 with ATK+DEF abilities. Has the flexibility to ignore ATK+DEF abilities and wear clothing or use other elements. 9 Defensive Skills. If switching class, this cost setup is okay for a Crystal Breaker.

    7/2/5/7 - "Glass" Soldier
    ATK Abil Offense: 111.7k
    ATK+DEF Abil Offense: 113.6k
    Best build for ATK abilities. Base offense for either kind of ability is only slightly weaker than Lancer/Mage base offense. Only slightly weaker than the other Soldier builds when using ATK+DEF abilities if using all Fire monsters. Has the flexibility to ignore ATK+DEF abilities and wear clothing or use other elements. Easiest to take down with 7 Defensive Skills. If switching class, this is the best cost setup for a Crystal Breaker.
    I didn't look at 2/7/7/x or 4/7/7/x because giving up those weapon passives and procs looks wasteful. Someone else can figure it out and compare if they want.
    Now that you have offense values, you can compare damage between Lancer/Mage and the different Soldier builds if you want. The number of hits between all the abilities listed above are similar, so they're going to be affected by flat AP mods about the same. The higher power ones will get a little bit more oomph out of crits, but in general things are going to be relatively close if you consider their extra effects and conditions.

    Which of these Soldier builds is best? That's up for debate. I'll end with one last thing... the damage of an endgame Glass Soldier's Crit Counter Strike.
    111.7 * 0.4 * 2.5 * 1.55 = 173.135
    That's 173k damage with no elemental bonuses and no buffs. For 5 cost.
    IGN: Mirabelle | Guild: Too Nice
    UL ID: 2104891172

    Comment


    • Hatsya Souji
      Hatsya Souji commented
      Editing a comment
      I'm about to build that Hybrid build, since I also used to play Lancer too.

    • [WOC] Fenrir
      [WOC] Fenrir commented
      Editing a comment
      Tips to end the salt and become seasoned.

  • #3
    I think you're underestimating calamity a bit. It's not like it's hard to combo that after Undermine or Blood Oath, so it should always be hitting for 220 ap, a good 37.5% higher ap than soldier's rage slash. Also, the free 3-stack elemental boost passives is good for another 15% extra damage against any non-neutral enemy.

    And comparing lancers to soldiers... the good thing about lancers isn't the damage, it's break. If a lancer couldn't break, it would be a pretty terrible class.

    Anyway, I get what you're saying as far as it's still possible for soldiers to do good damage if they forego defense and build purely for dps, but even if that was "balanced", is that really what soldiers want? To be a glass cannon? I don't think anyone picks the soldier class with that in mind, but if attacks don't scale off of defense, that's what they're forced into doing. The fact that they scaled off defense before and don't now, when most of the community didn't see it as a problem, is sort of a slap in the face.

    Comment


    • Mirabelle
      Mirabelle commented
      Editing a comment
      PetPet Calamity should always be used in combo, I agree. It's not especially difficult, but the fact that it can't be used standalone is something, even if it's small. Calamity also has no special effects unlike Rage Slash and Death Pierce. That's why I think they're comparable.

      You could argue that the trade off between mage/soldier for the elemental boost is Soldiers having extra health.

      I think whether you're ''tanking'' or ''dps'' depends not only on your Cost allocation but also what abilities you decide to bring to quest/battle.
      Last edited by Mirabelle; 10-06-2016, 07:52 PM.

    • HotMessExpress
      HotMessExpress commented
      Editing a comment
      I think the argument is that soldiers shouldn't complain about gimp damage, since if a soldier wants to do damage, they can do it reasonably well. If they want to tank, then they shouldn't complain about lacking damage since that is not the primary goal of the build

    • Mirabelle
      Mirabelle commented
      Editing a comment
      HotMessExpress Yes. Thank you. Pre-5th ring Soldiers had the best of both worlds. No other class could build full-defense and still have good burst damage. And now there are 2 potential Soldier archetypes instead of just one.

  • #4
    I would never use 7weapons as soldier..full atk is not tank

    Comment


    • Exifea
      Exifea commented
      Editing a comment
      Tanks are practically useless in this game sadly.

  • #5
    No matter how you put it a DPS soldier is just a worse version of a lancer. Also, if you are ever casting calamity without a combo you are doing it wrong.
    Last edited by Chronic; 10-06-2016, 05:59 PM.

    Comment


    • Mirabelle
      Mirabelle commented
      Editing a comment
      Agreed that Calamity should always be used with combo.

      However, by that logic, you could say that Mages are just Lancers that can't cause Break. It's an oversimplification.

    • Gang
      Gang commented
      Editing a comment
      Mage is AOE DPS and Lancer is single.

      Archer is balance DPS lol
      Last edited by Gang; 10-06-2016, 11:37 PM.

  • #6
    I smell yesterdays conversation in this...
    IGN: Alexander
    ID:2061966018


    100% Grade A Smash

    Comment


    • Mirabelle
      Mirabelle commented
      Editing a comment
      x3

  • #7
    *raises hand*

    Umm, where does that leave Attack Stance, Basic Attack, Swift Smash, and Wizard Strike? Those skills also contribute to DPS as well... Also, don't forget Lancers can equip Soul Destroyer as a 23 cost monster that blows 25 cost monsters' cost efficiency out of the water. When +198, Soul Destroyer is more cost efficient than even +198 28 cost monsters (but not the 29 cost ones).

    I'm aware you're using 6 Vol&Renas as a way to show maximum ATK, but it's a terrible idea in practice, since ATK investment has diminishing returns with low hitcount attacks that already have high AP damage. Similar to what Ace mentioned before (open the comments here, reply #12), higher cost monsters aren't always better for non-Archer classes, and cheaper cost monsters like Peliasa and Soul Destroyer should be considered, allowing you more room for Armors/Helms.


    IGN: FN || Leaf ID: 2042811095

    This Is How You DO Play Lancers

    Comment


    • Mirabelle
      Mirabelle commented
      Editing a comment
      @LaconicLeaf
      Good question about Attack Stance, Basic Attack, Swift Smash, Wizard Strike. I was focused on 5th ring, and I haven't looked into those. If you'd like to do the homework on comparing them, be my guest! I was mostly concerned about people bashing 5th ring soldier skills and advocating cost setups that don't run max weapons.

      Fair point about Monster cost-efficiency. Using more CE monsters might give you room to equip an extra helmet, which changes things slightly. That could boost all 3 of the Soldier builds over Lancer/Mage a little bit. I don't have the energy to redo the math on it at the moment, though.
      EDIT: Hmm, nevermind. I think that would only affect Hybrid and Glass.
      Last edited by Mirabelle; 10-06-2016, 09:02 PM.

  • #8
    So you're essentially saying that Clerics don't have a way to DPS effectively anymore by cross-classing.

    Boo.

    Comment


    • HotMessExpress
      HotMessExpress commented
      Editing a comment
      Price to pay for being the tankiest class

    • Mirabelle
      Mirabelle commented
      Editing a comment
      At the risk of getting off-topic... I think Clerics can build with 7 weapons as well and do just fine. Healing does scale more off of MATK than MDEF, and more Cost Recovery or healing procs can be a big deal.

  • #9
    Let me start off by saying that this isn't new information to me. I have known this for a while.

    I have absolutely no interest in completely changing my build when:

    1) When I already have great triple infused reflect helms.

    2) I have no clue what direction soldier is going right now. Who knows in 6th ring att soldiers will be useless.

    3) I have no interest in shelling out loads of gems to reallocate, soldier is the only class that has to deal with this bs and this is completely unfair for non whale players not that its fair to whale players either. They cannot simply change their builds and gear so easily.


    Now let me talk about how soldier damage doesn't come close to lancer dmg in actuality.

    The problem isn't that soldier weapons suck attackwise which make them have less attack potential. Soldiers can't break like lancers can which is exceedingly important. The fact that you nonchalantly say oh soldiers just have a few thousand less attack potential is hilarious because thats not all. Break is extremely important since it makes the enemies defenses almost nonexistent, lancers have way more utility.
    Now I will say one positive thing. Att soldiers can absolutely neuter fl archers but thats about the only good thing I can say about them but archer with DA can kill a squishy soldier pretty easily too even with the 30 ap reduction.

    Basically you haven't stated anything new to most experienced soldiers. Your arguments actually aren't even what annoys soldiers the most. Not everyone has hundreds of gems to shell out on a whim and even if they do maybe they don't want to. Now about mages. They also need some changes too. I would say slightly better passives (not just elemental ones) and faster casting times alone would help quite a bit.

    But really i appreciated the number crunching but that gear is a bit odd in my opinion. The Grimm gear has excellent stats but no one is going to have 7 triple infused grimm stuff except maybe Masq I am a whale and I don't even have one and physical reflect is a mediocre ability for a soldier anyway and I wouldn't touch Vol & Rena for stats with a 10 foot pole. Its stat efficiency is putrid.

    Last edited by felixng2016; 10-06-2016, 09:03 PM.
    Name: [FE]Nix
    ID: 2070886296
    GS:800k

    Comment


    • felixng2016
      felixng2016 commented
      Editing a comment
      I am not sure the difference but I notice lancers can neuter me pretty easily when I am broken and I have 120k defense and good defensive procs and what not.

    • LaconicLeaf
      LaconicLeaf commented
      Editing a comment
      That's because 120k DEF only mitigates like 24k damage. Assuming a 90k ATK Lancer attacks you with Cross Assault when you're inflicted with Break, they can deal from 44,040 (procless) to 74,280 (double proc) per hit of Cross Assault if none of your procs trigger! (after DEF mitigation is applied)

      Yup, 180 AP is that strong... Just imagine getting hit by Knight's Blitz twice (albeit slightly weaker), and there you go, that's Cross Assault for you.
      Last edited by LaconicLeaf; 10-07-2016, 01:31 AM. Reason: fixed errors in calculations

    • Mirabelle
      Mirabelle commented
      Editing a comment
      felixng2016 I would be very upset if I had 6 or 7 triple-infused Reflection XL helms and was encouraged not to use them. That's tough. :c

  • #10
    I don't think there's any point trying to convince people. Soldiers are stuck in the pre-5th ring lancer rut, where they think they're useless. Except lancers were actually just semi-solid meat bags who could give a wet slap every once in a while. Meanwhile soldiers are still semi useful in GvG. I actually want to be a soldier so I can have some sort of half-answer to this ridiculous archer meta. Hand your accounts over bois. I'll trade my lancer. Only for GvG though. I'd rather die than play a soldier for PVE content.

    Comment


    • Hatsya Souji
      Hatsya Souji commented
      Editing a comment
      Useful as bunkers, not as a supporting attacker

  • #11
    No soldier main in their right mind would run Rage Slash or Dual Impact. Lol.

    Comment


    • Mirabelle
      Mirabelle commented
      Editing a comment
      distime Please look up the 'No true Scotsman' fallacy, if you get a chance.

      If a 7-weapons Soldier knows she's up against Mages or Archers and doesn't have generic Reflection XL gear, she could run all Magic Reflection XL or Magic Damage Down XL gear and go full ATK. At that point, Dual Impact is the best Soldier burst damage skill and hits pretty hard. Rage Slash becomes a niche tool for breaking through opponents who have tons of defensive procs, or reflect from opening skills or other sources.

    • distime
      distime commented
      Editing a comment
      @Mirabelle
      What you are describing is a tanky lancer build.

    • Hatsya Souji
      Hatsya Souji commented
      Editing a comment
      I run a tanky lancer build, distime, as in today 6/4/5/4 (may be 7/5/5/4 soon).

  • #12
    Not related but...I WANT JUSTICE FOR MAGE PASSIVE!!! I personally hate 5th ring mage passive. Complete useless in PvP, I dont need extra elemental damage.

    Oh and archers are being left out from the discussion, feel sad for them...HECK NOOOOOO, they r overpower and seriously need some adjustments in their attacks 😭
    ID: 2051877005
    Add me if ya want

    Comment


    • #13
      Originally posted by Steven View Post
      Not related but...I WANT JUSTICE FOR MAGE PASSIVE!!! I personally hate 5th ring mage passive. Complete useless in PvP, I dont need extra elemental damage.

      Oh and archers are being left out from the discussion, feel sad for them...HECK NOOOOOO, they r overpower and seriously need some adjustments in their attacks 😭
      I agree mages need some love too.

      Name: [FE]Nix
      ID: 2070886296
      GS:800k

      Comment


      • Steven
        Steven commented
        Editing a comment
        Ikr 😔. Being the squishist class in the game is not fun. Always get target first, the most gang bang favorable character 😂. Some extra def/mdef would help

    • #14
      Soldier aren't terrible, we are just last. Most important of all, what Ateam doing doesn't make any sense.

      Lets make Mage and Archer attack scale of defense. I wouldn't even lower your damage, you just have to change your build for the better. Now shell out 240 gems to change to 3/7/7/3.

      Masq is a soldier, he doesn't come to the forum and complaint because he just whale out any build/class. Normal people can't.

      Here is what going to happen with all these whining.

      Just like the old Lancer, we going to get some buff in the next skills update.

      Just like the 5th ring Soldier, archer going to get shafted for the 6th ring.

      This is how every game work, they buff and over nerf, it's the same everywhere.

      But by then, us veterans will be gone, a new wave of players will be posting here.
      Last edited by Gang; 10-06-2016, 11:42 PM.
      "All of our unhappiness comes from our inability to be alone." Jean de la Bruyere

      Comment


      • felixng2016
        felixng2016 commented
        Editing a comment
        I would say a properly built soldier might top mage which is also a bit weak but def not lancer but lancers are weak against archers so thats a pro in soldiers favor.

      • Zerockl
        Zerockl commented
        Editing a comment
        Originally posted by Stoic View Post
        Just like the 5th ring Soldier, archer going to get shafted for the 6th ring.
        hahaha no

      • Amber
        Amber commented
        Editing a comment
        Unless they nerf deadly archers will always be op

    • #15
      This reminds me of the days where lancers complained about being so weak xD I feel your pain
      But I'm kinda glad they made soldiers do less damage they should be tanks not berserkers! I know tanking may not be relevant right now but I'm sure maybe they'll adjust some stuff eventually to make soldiers super tanks!! Maybe one day soldiers will be able to absorb AOEs for the whole party or something you know? That would be amazing!

      Comment


      • Amber
        Amber commented
        Editing a comment
        Isn't that KD
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