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    Reflect

    Why do pve monsters have this? It was terrible in tower of judgement and it's terrible in this event. It's terrible everywhere except pvp where our hp is roughly equivalent. Monsters have 10s of millions of hp, and reflect is insta death outside piercer. I shouldn't have to be afraid of casting siphon and the mon popping reflect and insta killing me for dmg equivalent to 20x my hp gauge.

    If you couldn't tell this was brought about from the inclusion of a bunch of Kotaros in the new event, which are able to cast reflect fast enough to counter most moves.

    #2
    equip reflect reduction ezclap

    jokes aside, probably just to add an edge to quests. I would just wait to attack until I see what move the mon is gonna do

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      #3
      Kotaro can only use Reflect under 50% HP so you're safe till then. You can use a Frenzy / Piercer / Kijin monster since you'll have unison at that point. Or, just do what Bev said and equip Reflect Reduction / wait until Kotaro declares his attack before moving.

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        #4
        This was a pretty standard thing to expect and deal with for the first year of the game. It may kill you the first few times, but I think after you die to it three times, it's your fault for being careless. I've explained it in the past by describing two different playstyles, Predictionary and Reactionary:

        Prediction - Act in response to what you think the opponent(s) will do. This gives you a preemptive advantage and higher DPS output, but is susceptible to reckless habits and punishment for bad decisions. If you are fully aware of what the enemy is capable of, you can operate on a good risk versus reward trade-off and come out extremely well. If you have extremely good intuition, you could get good results from high skill abilities like Guard, Devoted Sacrifice, Sanctuary of Light, and any healing role... but if your intuition isn't good, you're going to make a LOT of mistakes.

        Reaction - Act in response to what the opponent(s) does. This method is cautionary, lower DPS, and develops extremely good habits. You will manage your cooldowns much better, but you will also waste fully cooldowned abilities. Your timing for utilities like Mass Refresh and Balancing will be perfected, your synergy with high skill abilities such as Guard, Devoted Sacrifice, and Sanctuary of Light, and any healing role will be far better than the average player. And you won't make as many misplays, such as suiciding into reflect, tunnel vision yourself into getting stuck in attack animations that stop you from important skills like unison dodging.




        The only thing that could be done was to attack only after the enemy is mid-animation and to adopt a more defensive playstyle so you don't braindead mash your way to suicide.

        There are now answers for it: Reflect/Barrier removal unisons (Odin) or Frenzy/Piercer (Pollux) unisons, Lancer's Shield Break, Piercing attacks, and of course, Reflect Reduction XL constant armors.
        It is simply a matter of restraint or preparation now and I don't think it should be a real issue for anyone after they have identified it.
        Last edited by Nemurerumori; 06-08-2019, 01:40 PM.
        Nemurerumori / Sword / Fujin
        Guild: COLOSSUS
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        • Phoenix
          Phoenix commented
          Editing a comment
          For the first year of the game it wasn't much of a problem, power creep hadn't set in yet. It was more of a mechanic that could chip away at your health if you kept mashing (kotaro and dullahan were still somewhat dangerous though). Now it's death x20. I'm pretty sure that's not intended. Along the way it broke and became unbalanced, same way with the meta of one shotting a guild crystal back in the day until they introduced buffs to it. It's a broken mechanic at this point.

          Plus, I want to point out that most of the solutions you listed are relying on gem spawns (Monsters with frenzy/piercing, and especially reflect reduction which is more recent and hard to get). Only reliable way is piercing moves.

          Now if you don't think the mechanic is broken, I'd like to point out reflect was taken off the mons in tower of judgement at one point (and later changed cpu behavior) because the cpu would still atk and insta kill themselves on it. That wasn't intended, but came about because of how broken reflect has become when our dmg numbers are in the millions.
          Last edited by Phoenix; 06-08-2019, 11:29 PM.

        • Nemurerumori
          Nemurerumori commented
          Editing a comment
          reflect was always instant suicide for middle and top level players lol

          it's much easier to deal with now than it has ever been... the old method was to literally just not attack and it was like 4 times as frequent to deal with in PvE than it is now

          powercreep is not an excuse, it is just people like to mash buttons too much nowadays, especially since cost is a lot easier to have

          and like I said.... Shield Break
          Last edited by Nemurerumori; 06-09-2019, 03:14 PM.

        #5
        came here to talk 'bout how annoying reflect is, even if it's a game-balancing move

        yes, yes the pve-reflect-ability forces you to wisely strategize and use piercer and frenzy to your advantage to avoid any issues. however, you can't always assume that's the case. Today I temporarily played as mage in the Altar of Light, and as I clicked Siphon, the Amaterasu cast her reflect. (bih i moved first-) and i died the end

        I wasn't that annoyed since it was only a 19 ap, 3-wave quest, but still, non-cleric players shouldn't be penalized/dead for casting attacks only to get themselves killed over a monster's annoying ability that they have no way of foreseeing

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          #6
          hhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
          Last edited by |Atlås|; 06-09-2019, 12:51 PM.

          Mages; 760k / 707k
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            #7
            you're an idiot if u don't learn after u died to the same reflect monster once or twice lol. Asking for monsters in pve to remove reflect is almost as asking the quest to be easier. Might as well request ateam to have no challenging quest at all. if u don't like it, spend money to get reflect reduc or on frenzy/piercer mons and be better. not hard. too bad if you're f2p that was your decision. ateam need to make money not waste time on ppl who play that doesn't spend on their game.

            Mages; 760k / 707k
            Archers; 686k / 614k
            Last updated: 6/20/2018

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            • Phoenix
              Phoenix commented
              Editing a comment
              Ok so let me get this straight. He calls me an idiot (because yes, I have died to Kotaro more than twice in my 3 years playing) and tells me to get better by spending more money (which he mentions isn't hard). On top of that he says that Ateam shouldn't worry about f2p players because they're a waste of time (and attempted to group me into that thus trying to invalidate my post). My apologies if I misunderstood, but I still have a feeling the intentions were to degrade me and I don't like that.
              Last edited by Phoenix; 06-10-2019, 11:55 PM.

            • Lindo
              Lindo commented
              Editing a comment
              You are a very aggressive person, no wonder you die to reflects. Try being a cleric!

            • Phoenix
              Phoenix commented
              Editing a comment
              I'm not trying to be aggressive, I was being aggressed. My last post was literally just a summary. Also I am a cleric main.

            #8
            Just bring an op lancer with shield break with you XP For real, Its easier now than ever before to get around reflect shields. Many options. If you are playing without friends or other players you should be paying attention to the enemy attacks and looking out for this.
            IGN: Tim
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              #9
              The good old times where reflect needed some reaction play and you couldn't just blitz through a run. I for one think that it made running events an actual challenge instead of pressing damage button. My guildie still dies to it and we just laugh together at how dumb he was for looking away or not equipping reflect reduction gear, no biggie.
              It was terrible in Tower of Judgment because your allies were CPUs and you couldn't do a thing about them hitting and killing themselves, leaving you alone as lone DPS on wave 1 in a 3-min timed event. Obviously that's frustrating. In events like this one though, the players are responsible for their own actions, so it's fair game.

              That being said, I know most random players in parties don't like to wait before attacking anyway, so I spam Siegfried until boss wave to throw them a safety vest and speed up the run.


              ¤ LichtKreis ¤

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              • |Atlås|
                |Atlås| commented
                Editing a comment
                if you can cope with it then what is even the point of your post? whining? or what?

              • Phoenix
                Phoenix commented
                Editing a comment
                I wanted to talk about why I don't like reflect and see what others thought about it since this is general discussion and reflect is a big part of the recent quest. I mean so far some of the responses have been calling me idiotic, casual, f2p, toxic, generally talking down to me, whiny, etc. The point of my post was to give my stance in the opening and clarify or defend why I thought that way in the comments if someone disagreed.

                If what I did was wrong then I'm sorry to everyone involved. My goal wasn't to offend people.

              • Nemurerumori
                Nemurerumori commented
                Editing a comment
                I mean if you're complaining about how an ability that is eighteen times slower than the average human reaction time with built-in mechanics that specifically discourage you from using it recklessly getting punished as an example then that really just invalidates the value of your argument.

                The game bending over backwards to delete mechanics that casual players figured out on how to deal with on their day 1 because you dont like that people can't faceroll their buttons and win a quest against non-boss mobs that tend to die in 2 to 6 attacks 100% of the time is kinda eh at best.

                And QTEs can be good. You don't have to like them, but Heavy Rain made an entire game revolving around QTE and it was fantastic.
                Last edited by Nemurerumori; 06-13-2019, 01:36 PM.
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