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  • Reduced AP Quests

    Before I begin, I have to say that I appreciate Ateam reducing costs for certain quests such as the current event, because it means that we are able to get more rewards out of it. That being said, I feel that it has made things unnecessarily grindy. An average carnage run is maybe 10 mins long for an average player, sometimes way longer and of course sometimes shorter. If you have 200 AP, that would be 6 runs, which is a whole hour everytime your AP fills up. We get 630 AP a day, so you have to spend a few hours a day just running the quest (exclude time for finding party), and let's face it, running the same quest over and over again isn't the most exciting thing ever.

    Even if you do enjoy repeating the quest over and over again for some reason, there are some people in your party who might go on auto and it would take even longer, especially if they die. The DPS may do something else and multitask, but healers would actually have to focus more of the time and thus I feel that it might be kinda unfair to them.

    I think it might be a better idea to increase drop rates or lower reward requirements so that we can reduce this unnecessary grindfest. Grinding can be fun, but up to a point it would be meaningless to say the least, and I don't really see Ateam benefiting from it, or anyone at all.

  • #2
    If your taking ten minutes for a carnage run, then you shouldn't really be running carnage.
    I ran with a group of ~500k players who had low elemental attack ~5-8 with pretty good unisons (Mercury, Young Yasha, Tristan, Aqua) and we cleared in just over four minutes.

    What would you consider an average player?

    Comment


    • Lucelv
      Lucelv commented
      Editing a comment
      It's too bad if you're way above average and can carry others, but I'm average. 500k GS with 170+ edef and 20+ eatk.

    • Lunity
      Lunity commented
      Editing a comment
      That's about where I am, a bit higher. I am definitely not way above average.
      But you shouldn't be taking ten minutes a run for carnage at those stats.

    • Ouka
      Ouka commented
      Editing a comment
      I'm lower than you and still run carnage with my pals in like 3 or 4 mins. If it takes 10 mins to run any quest then nopetynopenope. Do another quest.

  • #3
    there are people out there who don't mind grinding these quests. Let them enjoy that. Plus, I finish carnage on average 5 minutes. Except for that one time where 4 archers carrying my weak cleric cleared it in a minute.

    Comment


    • Lucelv
      Lucelv commented
      Editing a comment
      Then they can make an option to double or triple the AP cost for the corresponding increase in rewards / prestige and let the extremely free people kill time all they like while the others can haste through.

  • #4
    Would love if they doubled the prestige in exchange for doubling AP cost for Micheal and Uriel quest since card flips don't really matter.

    But for the lucky cat I wouldn't want that since card flips.

    Comment


    • Lucelv
      Lucelv commented
      Editing a comment
      Yeah, I almost forgot about that. 12 ap a run that isn't auto-able was hell.

    • Lucelv
      Lucelv commented
      Editing a comment
      I have a feeling it's meant to be a 0 AP quest, but because of their "server problems" they made it 4 AP and decided that each subsequent difficulty should have a 4 AP increase.

  • #5
    I can't agree more. The increased amount of grinding is largely what drove me to retirement this week. And an emphasis on fast clear times has killed cleric, the class I enjoyed playing.

    We've had a slew of 0 and 4 AP quests that reward mindless grinding with great rewards such as 35c ninoyus. Those turn UL into a glorified idle game... And honestly, for an endgame cleric like myself carnage event quests aren't much better. Well-prepared parties don't need a cleric, and will kick you or have you uselessly build unison. The parties that actually need cleric have 10+ minute clear times and may be vulnerable to one-shots. Either way, I'm not having fun.

    The 15 minute time-outs in the 40c quest drove me over the edge. I just don't have the time anymore.

    Comment


    • 4tran
      4tran commented
      Editing a comment
      greenspiny Lucelv @
      A proper idle game will keep going automatically. Here, you can at most idle 1 quest at a time.

      I'm seriously considering retirement as well.
      1) I got a real job in Sept, and can no longer farm/grind/whatever whenever I want.
      2) I absolutely loathe this recent grindfest. If I ignore, I descend into obsolescence; the further I fall the harder it is to crawl back.
      3) The difficulty spike. Even with active participation, I feel like I'm rapidly falling through the cracks. Not long ago, I could regularly participate in arcadia/paragon, and could easily idle elite. Now I just get kicked left and right. I'm ~411gs, and most people I see are 500-600k.
      4) Inventory overflowing. The half of my time that isn't spent grinding is spent micromanaging the damn inventory, which they apparently refuse to increase.

      I dunno, I just feel drained. I mostly quit VC for the same reasons.

    • Lucelv
      Lucelv commented
      Editing a comment
      4tran

      Couldn't agree more about the inventory part... We are expected to have elemental set for each element, and PVP and PVE sets, and all the half-assed things that are too good to throw and too bad to keep.

      I think I spent more gems than anything else expanding my inventory.

    • 4tran
      4tran commented
      Editing a comment
      Lucelv @
      Maxing my inventory was one of the first things I did lol.

  • #6
    So... The complaint is that you can't empty your AP easily?

    I must be missing something here.
    Hot Mess Express 2086796674

    Comment


    • Lucelv
      Lucelv commented
      Editing a comment
      No dude, that's not a right analogy. When you buy things at a store, the things inherently has some use. So if the store charges less, everyone gets more. But UL accounts are inherently worthless and its worth is tied to how it compares to the other players. If everyone had a slew of cost 36 monsters, yours wouldn't be deemed as valuable. It's all about comparisons and rankings. People who are not going to put in effort / gems in an event are not going to do it any more just because it's cheaper.

      If you want an analogy, it's more like setting an exam very hard so all the students come out crying. But whether the exam is very hard or a normal standard, most likely the smart and studious students will come up at the top while the sloppy ones come up at the bottom. I'm not advocating that the exam (quest) should be so easy that there is not distinction between the good and the bad. In fact, for this case, I'm not even saying that it has to be easier. It just has to be less time-consuming.

    • HotMessExpress
      HotMessExpress commented
      Editing a comment
      That's a bad analogy, because the quest is not hard.

      The portion of your complaint I'm talking about seemed to center around the fact that the AP cost is reduced. All I'm saying is that's a terrible thing to complain about.

      You say yourself that it's about putting in ''effort / gems'' and I'm saying that reduced AP cost allows people with dedication to gain rewards without spending gems. The game is no fun if the only way to flourish is solely by spending gems.

      It's already ''who can p2w the hardest'' enough in UL. I like that some aspects still require thought and effort.

    • Lucelv
      Lucelv commented
      Editing a comment
      For the last time, the quests are not too HARD, they are too GRINDY. Similarly, in exams, when they are "hard", it means you have to memorise more content. GRINDY!

      You can make it less grindy, and BOTH gemmers and non-gemmers can get the rewards without wasting too much of their time AS LONG AS THEY CAN PASS IT.
      We don't have issues passing the quest, we have issues with how long it takes. And that is going to be even harder on defensive classes like rooks and clerics.

  • #7
    I definitely agree that we need to increase the efficiency of grinding Quests. It is often difficult getting runs being here in Japan on the global server, so it is even more painful for me.
    I'll see if we can work something out with the team for the future.

    Comment


    • Lucelv
      Lucelv commented
      Editing a comment
      Thank you!

  • #8
    Originally posted by greenspiny View Post
    I can't agree more. The increased amount of grinding is largely what drove me to retirement this week. And an emphasis on fast clear times has killed cleric, the class I enjoyed playing.

    We've had a slew of 0 and 4 AP quests that reward mindless grinding with great rewards such as 35c ninoyus. Those turn UL into a glorified idle game... And honestly, for an endgame cleric like myself carnage event quests aren't much better. Well-prepared parties don't need a cleric, and will kick you or have you uselessly build unison. The parties that actually need cleric have 10+ minute clear times and may be vulnerable to one-shots. Either way, I'm not having fun.

    The 15 minute time-outs in the 40c quest drove me over the edge. I just don't have the time anymore.
    Why this timeout pushed you towards the edge

    Comment


    • greenspiny
      greenspiny commented
      Editing a comment
      It was just frustrating. Spending 15 minutes on one quest is hard on your schedule, but to lose like that when the boss is at 25% HP...

      Btw, I came back to the game after a hiatus. As a casual though, no longer do all the dailies or attend all the GBs. But I can at least play with my friends.
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